How to quiz your client

Dear readers: Every design for a client starts with a creative brief. You can read about that here, but do it later; the short version is something like this:

Rule #1: Listen.
Rule #2: Understand and embrace the client’s vision.
Rule #3: Write it down. You and the client sign it.
Rule #4: Design that. Don’t design something else.

The process of making the brief can sometimes be shortcut but usually not. For time’s sake, I usually try. It rarely works.

The following will be an audience-participation project. It begins as a conversation between Gayle Heatherington — executive director of the Ars Viva Symphony Orchestra — and me. I publish it because I want you to hear the question-answer process that leads up to the creative brief. Keep in mind that we’re corresponding long distance — she in Illinois and I in California — which requires questions that an on-site meeting may not. At the end, I’ll ask for volunteers to work on a design solution.

Gayle begins: I love your discussions of logos and wonder if you (and your readers) would be interested in commenting on ours. Our name is actually our logo. It is made up of two fonts: Linotext Std and Van Dijk Std.

The name of the orchestra is Ars Viva, which means “living art.” Our concerts often juxtapose beloved masterworks with less-familiar repertoire. Hence, the current logo has Ars in an old-style font and Viva in a modern, forward-looking font with an exclamation mark. This is to represent the old and the new. Trite?

I would be interested in investigating whether a change would helps us brand our image better. Also, the name itself is a challenge for most people, and they don’t know what it means. I have wondered if an actual logo in addition to the name might help make us more easily recognizable.

The orchestra was founded by our music director (my husband!) 15 years ago. One of its distinctives is that he gives friendly, informative remarks to the audience from the stage that provide context for the music and establish a welcoming atmosphere at each concert. Also, the orchestra is comprised of many of the finest musicians in Chicago, including members of the world-renowned Chicago Symphony Orchestra. Therefore, the quality is extremely high, yet not “stuffy” and unapproachable.

In case you wish to take this project on, you can find more information about the orchestra at our web site: www.arsviva.org. [Readers: While you're there, don't miss this essay.]

I would appreciate any comments you may have about our current logo and any thoughts you and your readers may have about alternative logos.

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Hi Gayle,

Thank you for your great story.

Questions:

When you say your name is a “challenge for most people,” is the challenge . . .

1) that they have trouble pronouncing it?
2) that they don’t know what it means?
3) that they can’t position it in their minds? (i.e.: I understand what the Chicago Symphony Orchestra is, but what’s the Ars Viva Symphony Orchestra? Public? Private? Big? Small? Professional? Amateur? And so on.)
4) Other?

When you wonder if a change “would help us brand our image better,” it sounds like you’re referring to #3 above.

When you wonder about an “actual logo,” I presume you have in mind a mark like the Chicago Symphony Orchestra’s, in addition to your name. Yes? No?

Is Ars Viva something like the Boston Pops?

John

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Dear John,

Here are the answers to your questions.

When you say your name is a “challenge for most people,” is the challenge

1) that they have trouble pronouncing it?

Yes, a lot of people don’t realize it is two Latin words, and they think the first word is simply three letters, and they call us A-R-S Viva, which, of course, means nothing.

2) that they don’t know what it means?

Yes, we have often been asked by patrons what the name means. This gives us a chance to explain the “old and new” music concept, but only to those who ask!

3) that they can’t position it in their minds? (i.e., I understand what the Chicago Symphony Orchestra is, but what’s the Ars Viva Symphony Orchestra? Public? Private? Big? Small? Professional? Amateur? And so on.)

Correct here, too.

When you wonder if a change “would help us brand our image better,” it sounds like you’re referring to number 3 above.

Really all three. But number 3 is much more challenging. We don’t have a location to call home: Chicago Symphony, Elgin Symphony, Rockford Symphony, St. Paul Chamber Orchestra, etc. We perform in Skokie, Illinois, but we are a regional orchestra, and Skokie is not really our home town. Skokie already has an amateur orchestra (Skokie Valley Symphony), and we don’t want to be confused with them.

An organization like Music of the Baroque has a name that clearly explains what you can expect when you attend one of their concerts, and it was a very good name for building this organization. But we don’t perform just one style of music — in fact, quite the opposite!

When you wonder about an “actual logo,” I presume you have in mind a mark like the Chicago Symphony Orchestra’s, in addition to your name. Yes? No?

Yes. Maybe if the name is confusing, at least people can get used to seeing the logo and recognize us that way.

Is Ars Viva something like the Boston Pops?

Well, if you mean performing pops repertoire, then no. In the sense that we have a lot of the same players as the CSO, then yes. But the Boston Pops is run by the Boston Symphony, and we are a completely independent organization. We are more like the St. Paul Chamber Orchestra. We are a chamber-size orchestra (though we have not called ourselves that), and we perform in a smaller space than the CSO — more intimate — and the rapport with the audience when my husband talks to them is relaxed, entertaining and informative. But the music is serious, not pops. We offer people in the suburbs the opportunity to hear a world-class orchestra close to home. The commute to Chicago is daunting for many! Even if they are subscribers to the CSO, they can see many of the same players on our stage and hear interesting music that they don’t often play downtown.

Gayle

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Hi Gayle,

Your current logo is built on an interesting typographic concept [old and new], but its rendering is rough. Easiest place to start is to polish your idea to see if better typography will help. Attached are three possibilities, all similar. The colors are derived from your Web site. It may take some time for my fantasy to catch up to your reality. Just give me a reaction.

John

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Dear John,

Of the three examples, I like #3 best.  #1 — the Viva is too hard to read. It could look like Ars Uiua. #2 is okay but doesn’t jump out at me. I like the Viva font in #3.

Reduced to the size they would be on a letterhead, return envelope, small print ad, etc., I suspect that there would be a real problem reading Alan’s name. Also, the very thin lines of the typeface for the “Ars” would disappear in printing. I often print our logo reversed on a black background, and the very thin lines would be swallowed up with black ink.

Because Alan is the founding music director of our orchestra, his name should be more prominent. He is actually part of our image. He is very well known in the Chicago area, and so his name actually is pretty important. His name could even be on top of the logo!  :+)

Ideally, I would like a logo that can be reduced, stacked, printed in color, black or white. The design restrictions for multicolor logos present too many problems. The man who designed our logo originally had the Viva! in a rainbow of colors — like your “After.” I liked it but quickly had to drop it for practical reasons.

We also used to have a byline that we often printed near our logo that read Making music come to life. Much like your How to design cool stuff. It was printed under a treble clef that had a leaf growing out of it. I don’t know if this helped explain the name or not. The treble clef was actually an S in some font turned around! See below.

We used different words underneath: Discover it! Share it! Experience it! But soon just dropped that part.

Gayle

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Hi Gayle,

Thanks for the helpful feedback.

I should have been clearer. My interest at this early stage is only in the form factor, that is, what the typefaces alone convey. Color, size, usability — that will come later. Same for Alan’s name.

The final logo will be usable in all sizes, colors, resolutions, etc. In this case, the fonts have heavier-line versions for reproduction under more difficult conditions.

I like the Viva font in #3.

That’s the one we did first. Do you like your original concept of a two-typeface logo? If so, our job will be to find the right two typefaces. Or are you hoping for a new direction?

We also used to have a byline that we often printed near our logo that read “Making music come to life.”

I like this image and the byline. It doesn’t explain your name, but it gives me a sense of what you’re about.

I understand your name. That’s because you told me up front that it means living art. You also explained the kind of music you play, and your husband’s role not only as founder and director but as something of a curator for the audience.

The impression I’ve formed, therefore, is of a warm, rich, light, comfortable, educational, music experience — very appealing. Your Web site conveys this.

You have two sets of goals. One is to have a logo. The other is to tell your story in its various ways. The logo can tell the story but doesn’t have to.

Tell me more.

John

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[Dear readers: In trying to shortcut this process, I omitted several developmental steps and assumed, without thinking, that Gayle could read my mind, which, of course, she couldn't. Her first impression, therefore, was formed like yours -- she saw what's on the page, accurately, and responded to it. First impressions are strong. Her sense that this logotype has problems -- observed from experience, obviously -- taints it. Now, elements that should have been presented up front -- black & white, robust type, etc. -- may be seen as "corrections" rather than integral parts of the image. That's an uphill road that neither you nor the client should have to climb. Beginner's mistake.]

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John,

I should have been clearer. My interest at this early stage is only in the form factor; that is, what the typefaces alone convey. Color, size, usability — those will come later. Same for Alan’s name.

Tell me more.

Well, I’ll try. It is hard for me not to look at something as a finished product, having never been through this process before! I got one response from a friend that the “Ars” font impressed her as Art Deco, which would not really work for us.

Do you like your original concept of a two-typeface logo? If so, our job will be to find the right two typefaces. Or are you hoping for a new direction?

Your probing questions have caused us to think about what we really want our name to convey. The consensus is that the concept of “old and new” (types of music we perform) is not as important as conveying excellence, energy, intimacy, excitement, newness, variety, freshness and a sense of “classiness but not stuffiness.” So, to answer your question, two typefaces are not necessary.

The impression I’ve formed, therefore, is of a warm, rich, light, comfortable, educational music experience — very appealing.

These words are all very good at describing the Ars Viva experience! You have captured the essence of what we are about. I might only add that the performers are world-class musicians who perform at a very high artistic level. Ars Viva gives you great music and musicians who are accessible.

Gayle

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Hi Gayle,

Before I lose this iteration entirely, here’s a modified version. For now, we’re looking only at the signature. This one’s minus the color, it has a clearer V, and the hint of Art Deco is gone. The Ars typeface is classic Garamond, which was in use in the 18th and 19th centuries and probably advertised some of these original performances!Moving on, the logo below on the left is for an upcoming Before & After project that has the same initials as Ars Viva. You’d need different colors, but does the form factor appeal to you? If so, can you picture it as the basis of a logo for the orchestra? The image below on the right is a pure ligature — a more organic image that takes advantage of the natural fit of your two letters.

John

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Dear John,

I like it and can picture it, an offhand impression. My husband thinks it is harsh and angular and doesn’t represent Ars Viva. Alan says the one on the right is going in the right direction — “it has flow and looks musical.”

Gayle

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Hi Gayle,

“It has flow and looks musical.” That’s a clue.

Let’s return to the beginning. I’ve attached our article “Design from a creative brief.” Please read it, especially pages 3 and 4, then with your husband and whoever else you’d like, do your best to describe your logo project and its goals, and get back to me.

Thank you!

John

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Hi John,

While “Design from a creative brief” seems to start with an image (dragonfly) and go from there, I have tried to use its format here:

Audience: Mostly over 50. Affluent.
Core target: Empty-nesters who have disposable time and income. Many of them played a musical instrument or sang when they were young.
Secondary target: Parents of young children (we have a special Music for Life program that targets 4- to 11-year-olds and brings in 20 or so young families to each concert.)
Tertiary targets: Corporations and foundations (especially important when applying for a grant)

Goals/Project Objectives:
Attract interest and respect and a sense of uniqueness.
Make the name more understandable (if possible) and readable.

Message:
“Approachable Excellence.” This is the phrase we came up with to describe Ars Viva in a nutshell.

Other words:
Professional, world-class, exciting, lively, fresh, new, elegant, classical, unique

We want to convey to the typical classical music concert-goer that we stand for the quality they expect from the Chicago Symphony; i.e., professionalism, trust, credibility.

However, we want to convey that their experience will be more personal, immediate, “up close,” and that the music and the musicians are approachable.   The conductor speaks to the audience from the stage (often with humorous comments) and makes the whole experience terribly enjoyable. The music is enjoyed more because it has been “unwrapped” for the audience before they hear it. But I digress . . .

We want to convey that our music performances are fresh and new — living and relevant (not to be confused with “contemporary” and “far out.” At Ars Viva, you might hear a symphony that you’ve heard all of your life, but it will feel like a new experience. There is a lot of energy and excitement at our performances.

Approaches:
Ars Viva Symphony Orchestra
Ars Viva Symphony
AVSO
AVS

All of these are okay. The only requirement is that the name must include: “Alan Heatherington, Music Director.”

If you work on a logo (separate from the name), you could use a musical symbol (baton, treble clef, bass clef, violin, etc. Other symbols would also be fine — a leaf or vine or tree or bird — something from nature that conveys the “living” aspect.

We would like the logo to be used in color and black & white. As a practical matter, I would prefer only one or two colors. When I asked the board what color they thought AV represented, I got “blue” and “green” or “teal.” But this is open to any suggestion of yours.

The following is from an earlier email, and I liked it, so I have copied it again here:

The consensus is that the concept of “old and new” (types of music we perform) is not as important as conveying excellence, energy, intimacy, excitement, newness, variety, freshness and a sense of “classiness but not stuffiness.” So, to answer your question, two typefaces are not necessary.

The impression I’ve formed, therefore, is of a warm, rich, light, comfortable, educational, music experience — very appealing.

These words are all very good at describing the Ars Viva experience! You have captured the essence of what we are about. I might only add that the performers are world-class musicians who perform at a very high artistic level. Ars Viva gives you great music and musicians who are accessible.

Okay, that is what we have so far. If you need more information, please let me know.

Gayle

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Dear readers: There you have it. Although there’s no substitute for meeting the principals face to face and (in this case) experiencing a live performance — we have a good creative brief. Gayle’s patient descriptions, plus her Web site, provide a clear look at the goals ahead. Feel free to comment on what you’ve just read. Feel free to submit your own creative brief questions. And feel free to try your hand designing a new logotype for the symphony. Do this only if you’re serious. If you have questions or want clarifications, ask. Send your work directly to me. We’ll select several for critique.

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