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	<title>Comments on: How to quiz your client</title>
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	<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/</link>
	<description>Before &#38; After&#039;s creative director John McWade&#039;s conversations with subscribers</description>
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		<title>By: Mike Roberts</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-5753</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Roberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Nov 2010 22:09:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-5753</guid>
		<description>Do we get to see the final logo?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do we get to see the final logo?</p>
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		<title>By: Monique Kalmokoff</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3372</link>
		<dc:creator>Monique Kalmokoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jul 2010 22:16:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3372</guid>
		<description>Love the first 4 rules . . . rules to live by with your client so everybody is happy with the result.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Love the first 4 rules . . . rules to live by with your client so everybody is happy with the result.</p>
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		<title>By: Rachelle Johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3244</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachelle Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jul 2010 18:45:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3244</guid>
		<description>Hi John!  

What a great example. As my &quot;design&quot; philosophy centers primarily around branding, I start each and every project by going through a &quot;Brand Personality Process.&quot;  It&#039;s a standard, three-page, in-depth questionnaire that I send to every client, followed by extensive conversation, and culminating in a one-page &quot;brand personality brief,&quot; which seems simple at a glance -- but it&#039;s the result of a great deal of research and conversation about the client, industry, and project at hand. This serves as the foundation for everything -- and its value is incalculable, if you ask me. By the end of this process, the client and I are always on the same page, and completing the project becomes much easier. Usually I&#039;ve gathered enough information that we hit the nail on the head with the first or second design idea -- since I already have such a good idea of what they&#039;re looking for. Often, the process also serves as a catalyst for the design ideas themselves -- greatly simplifying my design process.

I&#039;m surprised that you didn&#039;t seem to have a standard process for gathering this information to begin with. You spent a lot of time asking somewhat unrelated questions before you really cracked the nut by having her read that article, where she was able to respond to a specific set of questions that painted a complete picture. (And you were lucky -- most clients aren&#039;t that thoughtful in their responses and wouldn&#039;t have thought to &quot;mirror&quot; the article). &lt;em&gt;Start&lt;/em&gt; with the process, and then let it develop into the type of conversation you had -- you&#039;ll get more out of it. (Okay, not that I&#039;m advising you here, but since this is your example . . . )

Looking back on the days when I tried to cut corners and shoot from the hip, I cringe a bit -- skipping this essential step is the #1 cause of issues I&#039;ve seen myself, and with other designers. Since implementing this process, I&#039;ve had nothing but thrilled clients and great results -- and &lt;em&gt;much&lt;/em&gt; less stress throughout the design process.

I also set the tone for very open, honest communication -- so the client is comfortable communicating about problems when they occur. That can be difficult to do; probably the #1 issue I have is clients who sheepishly tell me they like things that they really don&#039;t.  Part of our job is making them comfortable enough to communicate, and then helping them figure out what they really want -- frustrating as it is, many clients don&#039;t really know until they see it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi John!  </p>
<p>What a great example. As my &#8220;design&#8221; philosophy centers primarily around branding, I start each and every project by going through a &#8220;Brand Personality Process.&#8221;  It&#8217;s a standard, three-page, in-depth questionnaire that I send to every client, followed by extensive conversation, and culminating in a one-page &#8220;brand personality brief,&#8221; which seems simple at a glance &#8212; but it&#8217;s the result of a great deal of research and conversation about the client, industry, and project at hand. This serves as the foundation for everything &#8212; and its value is incalculable, if you ask me. By the end of this process, the client and I are always on the same page, and completing the project becomes much easier. Usually I&#8217;ve gathered enough information that we hit the nail on the head with the first or second design idea &#8212; since I already have such a good idea of what they&#8217;re looking for. Often, the process also serves as a catalyst for the design ideas themselves &#8212; greatly simplifying my design process.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m surprised that you didn&#8217;t seem to have a standard process for gathering this information to begin with. You spent a lot of time asking somewhat unrelated questions before you really cracked the nut by having her read that article, where she was able to respond to a specific set of questions that painted a complete picture. (And you were lucky &#8212; most clients aren&#8217;t that thoughtful in their responses and wouldn&#8217;t have thought to &#8220;mirror&#8221; the article). <em>Start</em> with the process, and then let it develop into the type of conversation you had &#8212; you&#8217;ll get more out of it. (Okay, not that I&#8217;m advising you here, but since this is your example . . . )</p>
<p>Looking back on the days when I tried to cut corners and shoot from the hip, I cringe a bit &#8212; skipping this essential step is the #1 cause of issues I&#8217;ve seen myself, and with other designers. Since implementing this process, I&#8217;ve had nothing but thrilled clients and great results &#8212; and <em>much</em> less stress throughout the design process.</p>
<p>I also set the tone for very open, honest communication &#8212; so the client is comfortable communicating about problems when they occur. That can be difficult to do; probably the #1 issue I have is clients who sheepishly tell me they like things that they really don&#8217;t.  Part of our job is making them comfortable enough to communicate, and then helping them figure out what they really want &#8212; frustrating as it is, many clients don&#8217;t really know until they see it!</p>
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		<title>By: Wayne Beasley</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3205</link>
		<dc:creator>Wayne Beasley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jul 2010 03:34:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3205</guid>
		<description>Very interesting article and it applies to so  many areas of design. I work with web clients who &lt;em&gt;seem&lt;/em&gt; to think they know what they want. The client here &lt;em&gt;seems&lt;/em&gt; to know, yet the trouble is conveying the information first to the designer and then to the listener.

What I really think the company should be called is &quot;Alan Heatherington, Music Director.&quot; Re-read the emails. Once he&#039;s gone, what remains? The orchestra should be the legacy that lives on, acknowledges his commitment, but at the end of the day they have a life of their own and need to work towards a future.

I&#039;m surprised no one has commented on the &quot;ars&quot; meaning something different to most non-Latin speakers. Trying to design around that is the unstated challenge!

Really there&#039;s only one thing to do: start afresh.

Find a way to encompass the past and push towards a new future with an easier-to-understand name and logo that borrows from the past. Incorporate the Musical Director&#039;s name, knowing that at some stage (hopefully a while off!) this will change.

Alan Heatherington, Music Director presents . . . Viva!

My 2¢ worth :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting article and it applies to so  many areas of design. I work with web clients who <em>seem</em> to think they know what they want. The client here <em>seems</em> to know, yet the trouble is conveying the information first to the designer and then to the listener.</p>
<p>What I really think the company should be called is &#8220;Alan Heatherington, Music Director.&#8221; Re-read the emails. Once he&#8217;s gone, what remains? The orchestra should be the legacy that lives on, acknowledges his commitment, but at the end of the day they have a life of their own and need to work towards a future.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m surprised no one has commented on the &#8220;ars&#8221; meaning something different to most non-Latin speakers. Trying to design around that is the unstated challenge!</p>
<p>Really there&#8217;s only one thing to do: start afresh.</p>
<p>Find a way to encompass the past and push towards a new future with an easier-to-understand name and logo that borrows from the past. Incorporate the Musical Director&#8217;s name, knowing that at some stage (hopefully a while off!) this will change.</p>
<p>Alan Heatherington, Music Director presents . . . Viva!</p>
<p>My 2¢ worth :-)</p>
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		<title>By: xav</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3104</link>
		<dc:creator>xav</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 13:12:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3104</guid>
		<description>Sorry guys, but there is nothing wrong with the orchestra&#039;s name, as viva has been perfectly correct Latin for over 2,000 years, the feminine form of &quot;vivus&quot; -- alive, fresh, etc. Let&#039;s stay on topic :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry guys, but there is nothing wrong with the orchestra&#8217;s name, as viva has been perfectly correct Latin for over 2,000 years, the feminine form of &#8220;vivus&#8221; &#8212; alive, fresh, etc. Let&#8217;s stay on topic :-)</p>
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		<title>By: Don Cheke</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3083</link>
		<dc:creator>Don Cheke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 13:33:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3083</guid>
		<description>I have noticed that there has been much talk of a name change, even by Gayle in the original article. I would be very hesitant about changing the name, as it has existed for 15 years already. It has a following, and its following identifies it largely based on that name. Can you imagine if Pepsi or McDonald&#039;s decided to change their name what chaos it would produce? They would be starting from square one to redefine who they are and what they do. When Pepsi changed their logo recently, look at the stir it caused. People balked at the change, but they still knew it was still Pepsi. Perhaps a logo change is a good move now and again, as long as it is not so outrageous that it redefines, but instead keeps one current with the times. Had Pepsi changed their logo &lt;em&gt;and&lt;/em&gt; their name, people would have mourned the loss of a company that, in part, defines the western world.

At one point it was suggested that I change my business name, and I chose not to because I already had a huge visitor base with links from numerous followers. On top of that, I had (have) all kinds of printed materials that would require a costly change. In my opinion, growth and change don&#039;t require a name change, but it probably wouldn&#039;t hurt to have a History tab on one&#039;s web site or within one&#039;s portfolio, so that those interested can read about it and become even more involved on a more personal level -– growing and changing with you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have noticed that there has been much talk of a name change, even by Gayle in the original article. I would be very hesitant about changing the name, as it has existed for 15 years already. It has a following, and its following identifies it largely based on that name. Can you imagine if Pepsi or McDonald&#8217;s decided to change their name what chaos it would produce? They would be starting from square one to redefine who they are and what they do. When Pepsi changed their logo recently, look at the stir it caused. People balked at the change, but they still knew it was still Pepsi. Perhaps a logo change is a good move now and again, as long as it is not so outrageous that it redefines, but instead keeps one current with the times. Had Pepsi changed their logo <em>and</em> their name, people would have mourned the loss of a company that, in part, defines the western world.</p>
<p>At one point it was suggested that I change my business name, and I chose not to because I already had a huge visitor base with links from numerous followers. On top of that, I had (have) all kinds of printed materials that would require a costly change. In my opinion, growth and change don&#8217;t require a name change, but it probably wouldn&#8217;t hurt to have a History tab on one&#8217;s web site or within one&#8217;s portfolio, so that those interested can read about it and become even more involved on a more personal level -– growing and changing with you.</p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3077</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennifer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 04:10:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3077</guid>
		<description>Awesome article! Of course, I find pretty much everything Before &amp; After offers insightful and well done.

How awesome to have such an articulate client as well! Working with Gayle would certainly be a pleasure, I think.

I also believe that a name change may be in store, as it would address some of the issues that they currently feel they need to overcome. I do love layered meaning and hidden meanings a great deal, but I believe they can reach their ideal market with the crafting of a new name and look to truly convey more of the story. Not the entire story (too much for any logo!) but something that gives a brilliant hint of what to expect.

Their story is fantastic, and I would love to see them in person after reading it. 

I have just one question, and I&#039;m guessing many here know the answer: What is the font used for &quot;Viva&quot; in the first rendition of the revised logo? I am in love with it! So fluid and I adore how it shifts its weight. Beautiful.

So, can someone shed some light on this for me?

---------------
&lt;em&gt;[Jennifer, the typeface is &lt;a href=&quot;http://new.myfonts.com/fonts/hubertjocham/mommie/&quot;target=&quot;blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Mommie&lt;/a&gt;, by Hubert Jocham. It comes in three stroke weights for use in large, medium and small sizes. -- John M.]&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Awesome article! Of course, I find pretty much everything Before &amp; After offers insightful and well done.</p>
<p>How awesome to have such an articulate client as well! Working with Gayle would certainly be a pleasure, I think.</p>
<p>I also believe that a name change may be in store, as it would address some of the issues that they currently feel they need to overcome. I do love layered meaning and hidden meanings a great deal, but I believe they can reach their ideal market with the crafting of a new name and look to truly convey more of the story. Not the entire story (too much for any logo!) but something that gives a brilliant hint of what to expect.</p>
<p>Their story is fantastic, and I would love to see them in person after reading it. </p>
<p>I have just one question, and I&#8217;m guessing many here know the answer: What is the font used for &#8220;Viva&#8221; in the first rendition of the revised logo? I am in love with it! So fluid and I adore how it shifts its weight. Beautiful.</p>
<p>So, can someone shed some light on this for me?</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;<br />
<em>[Jennifer, the typeface is <a href="http://new.myfonts.com/fonts/hubertjocham/mommie/"target="blank" >Mommie</a>, by Hubert Jocham. It comes in three stroke weights for use in large, medium and small sizes. -- John M.]</em></p>
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		<title>By: Manuel Calderon de la Barca</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3073</link>
		<dc:creator>Manuel Calderon de la Barca</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jun 2010 18:41:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3073</guid>
		<description>Well, Keith commented here that the word Viva! is not in Latin, and he is right! But remember the song &lt;em&gt;Viva Las Vegas!&lt;/em&gt; It sounds more logical to everyone. I guess the problem here is centered not in the name but in the concept. 

When Gayle says they need a nature-based image, she is asking for a sensitive experience, as music is. I think that a focused approach to this concept is to apply some natural ornaments -- not much -- to the name. Or, maybe, changing the name for this:

Vivars!

It could solve many problems about the meaning of the &quot;art&quot; word -- Latin or Italian or Spanish -- and is a creative way to gather both words. For example, when a new car model arrives to the market, do you really consider criticism of its name: Stratus, Astra, Corolla, Camry, Platina. We must get out of the box to what it is exactly that Viva Ars Orchestra does actually!

Well, this is just a rough to start the creation process in our creative benches. Best.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, Keith commented here that the word Viva! is not in Latin, and he is right! But remember the song <em>Viva Las Vegas!</em> It sounds more logical to everyone. I guess the problem here is centered not in the name but in the concept. </p>
<p>When Gayle says they need a nature-based image, she is asking for a sensitive experience, as music is. I think that a focused approach to this concept is to apply some natural ornaments &#8212; not much &#8212; to the name. Or, maybe, changing the name for this:</p>
<p>Vivars!</p>
<p>It could solve many problems about the meaning of the &#8220;art&#8221; word &#8212; Latin or Italian or Spanish &#8212; and is a creative way to gather both words. For example, when a new car model arrives to the market, do you really consider criticism of its name: Stratus, Astra, Corolla, Camry, Platina. We must get out of the box to what it is exactly that Viva Ars Orchestra does actually!</p>
<p>Well, this is just a rough to start the creation process in our creative benches. Best.</p>
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		<title>By: AVN</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3072</link>
		<dc:creator>AVN</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jun 2010 14:21:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3072</guid>
		<description>Personally, I think including the director&#039;s name in the logo is a big mistake. That&#039;s something to be left to a letterhead or business card. A logo represents your company. If Microsoft had Bill Gates in script underneath, if every company had their director/CEO/president&#039;s name, the world would be a very cluttered place. Logos need to be simple, effective, eye catching, and not complicated enough to make people work to look at it. 

Perhaps one typeface in two weights. And treble clefs -- clichéd. Beautiful, but clichéd. 

Excellent design brief!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Personally, I think including the director&#8217;s name in the logo is a big mistake. That&#8217;s something to be left to a letterhead or business card. A logo represents your company. If Microsoft had Bill Gates in script underneath, if every company had their director/CEO/president&#8217;s name, the world would be a very cluttered place. Logos need to be simple, effective, eye catching, and not complicated enough to make people work to look at it. </p>
<p>Perhaps one typeface in two weights. And treble clefs &#8212; clichéd. Beautiful, but clichéd. </p>
<p>Excellent design brief!</p>
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		<title>By: Cathy</title>
		<link>http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/2010/06/how-to-quiz-your-client/comment-page-1/#comment-3071</link>
		<dc:creator>Cathy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jun 2010 13:54:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mcwade.com/DesignTalk/?p=4083#comment-3071</guid>
		<description>A couple of notes on this reading. Great information. I loved how the back-and-forth conversation went. Sometimes you need to show the client how you interpreted what they said, for both sides to clarify and realign the direction they are going. I do not see anything wrong with showing the client something in order to get feedback and ensure you are going in the right direction. And as mentioned, the client doesn&#039;t always know exactly what information to give you up front. And the designer may not know that the information they are getting from the client isn&#039;t exactly what the client wants. 

As for the recommendation to use Viva Musica, it is already similarly used in a Chicago suburb musical group as -- Musica Viva. 

I agree with the need for a name change. If the old one does not demonstrate the soul of the orchestra, then why keep it? It may have worked in the beginning, but it sounds like they have evolved from their origins. If you&#039;re going to make a change with fonts and logos now, then this is the time to make all the updates necessary. Go for the Gold! I love the idea that the director is well known and they want to use his name. Why not use his name? Viva Heatherington! (Look up Viva -- it includes acclaim or living voice.) The problem with using Latin, though, is that not everyone knows Latin, especially in a modern Chicago. Perhaps something like &#039;Heatherington Symphony.&#039; For a logo, use a feather pen, rhymes with Heatherington. And use a font that looks like musical notes similar to the #1. If the V looks like a U, then manipulate it. That&#039;s what typographers do; create your own font.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A couple of notes on this reading. Great information. I loved how the back-and-forth conversation went. Sometimes you need to show the client how you interpreted what they said, for both sides to clarify and realign the direction they are going. I do not see anything wrong with showing the client something in order to get feedback and ensure you are going in the right direction. And as mentioned, the client doesn&#8217;t always know exactly what information to give you up front. And the designer may not know that the information they are getting from the client isn&#8217;t exactly what the client wants. </p>
<p>As for the recommendation to use Viva Musica, it is already similarly used in a Chicago suburb musical group as &#8212; Musica Viva. </p>
<p>I agree with the need for a name change. If the old one does not demonstrate the soul of the orchestra, then why keep it? It may have worked in the beginning, but it sounds like they have evolved from their origins. If you&#8217;re going to make a change with fonts and logos now, then this is the time to make all the updates necessary. Go for the Gold! I love the idea that the director is well known and they want to use his name. Why not use his name? Viva Heatherington! (Look up Viva &#8212; it includes acclaim or living voice.) The problem with using Latin, though, is that not everyone knows Latin, especially in a modern Chicago. Perhaps something like &#8216;Heatherington Symphony.&#8217; For a logo, use a feather pen, rhymes with Heatherington. And use a font that looks like musical notes similar to the #1. If the V looks like a U, then manipulate it. That&#8217;s what typographers do; create your own font.</p>
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